[Tim]

Tim on May 31, 2023 at 1:35 am #21978

Hey there, still looking for the right one. There was a nice one in Seattle but the paint was coming off the leading edges and, well, an unpainted airframe in the salty humid air of FL didn’t really sound like a nice thing to do to such a nice plane, and we couldn’t stomach our new acquisition going right to the paint shop and kept from us for who knows how long…

There is an amazing Lance for sale up the road. Talked to the insurance guys at Falcon and they soft quoted a $10K annual premium for the first year. yikes.

[STEVE]

STEVE on May 30, 2023 at 9:16 pm #21977

Hi Tim;
Just reaching out to catch up on your progress toward finding “the airplane”

Howz it goin? 

Have you test flown any? 

Gotten a pre purchase on one?

Bought one and couldn’t be happier?

Best,
Steve

[Eric Parks]

Eric Parks on May 9, 2023 at 11:39 pm #21961

I think finding the right plane is more the factor than 260 vs 300. Things like condition, what avionics, engine life, paint and interior condition, etc. Both are probably good enough for your purposes. It’s been over 30 years since I was flying the 6 and I only flew the 300 hp, not the 260 hp verison. Maybe someone else has an opinion on it? HOWEVER, it’s funny you mention the fuel tank situation. I never liked the 4 tanks on the Cherokee 6 and needing to mangage them. So I agree that the newer planes with integrated tanks are nice. Again, you pay for your privilege!

[Tim]

Tim on May 9, 2023 at 5:45 pm #21960

Good stuff Eric, thank you! Did you fly a 300 or 260? I’m fairly certain I like the idea of finding a 1979 or newer C6/300 because they started using the integrated fuel tanks from the lance getting rid of the tip/main/zero fuel weight conundrum that persisted in the earlier models.

[Eric Parks]

Eric Parks on May 9, 2023 at 6:42 am #21958

For the Piper brand the Cherokee 6 is what you want. Plenty of room for people and bags (front and rear baggage) but pretty simple and rugged. I used to fly charter in one. I also flew the Lance (low tail, normally aspirated). The Lance (and Saratoga) are very nice but prices start high and go higher! I’m not sure the retract gear is worth the cost/weight but of course it’s pretty nice. You just pay for the privilege!
Passengers love the rear pax door and it has the extra baggage door in back as well. Any of the PA-32 series is a decent people carrier and for what you describe just about perfect.
The only experience I had with a T-tail Lance was not good. I personally would shy from it but I never flew it enough to get used to it.

[Tim]

Tim on May 9, 2023 at 2:20 am #21957

Thank you for the heads up! Yes with a family of 6, we pretty much are going to need every one of those seats 🙂

[STEVE]

STEVE on May 8, 2023 at 11:07 pm #21956

Hi Tim;
I see as I read this again that you wanted a six place–the Twin Comanche is not a six place.

I expect you’re as apt as I in reading ads and putting out feelers for the right airplane. You are certainly welcome to post a request in the forum for leads on a good 206, Cherokee 6 300 or other heavy hauler that fits your mission. It’s worth a try.

As you know prices have jumped recently. As I mentioned earlier, my experience is that new owners are happiest when the buy the best airplane they can afford. 

Will the Lance in the ad hold its value? Probably over the long term. It’s a very well equipped airplane.

Steve

 

[STEVE]

STEVE on May 5, 2023 at 9:11 pm #21949

Hi Tim;
Have you considered a Piper PA 30 Twin Comanche.
Kristin Winter, one of the techs here at Piper Flyer has one. 
If you’re at all interested, I can have her get in touch with you.
Basics are 
Two IO 320 engine (very durable)
MTOW 3600 # Avg useful load 1350
Avg cruise at 10K feet 160 knots
Avg fuel burn at 65% power 15.2 gph (for two engines)_
Normal fuel load 90 gallons; tip tanks add an additional 30 gallons.
Good support–I know I have a Piper single engine Comanche.
Check this ad:
https://www.barnstormers.com/classified-1813551-Piper-Twin-Comanche-PA-30.html?catid=21211

Second engine is insurance if you’re traveling to the islands.

Let me know if this trips your trigger.

S
 

[Tim]

Tim on May 4, 2023 at 2:12 am #21948

Hi Steve, thanks so much for your detailed response! I’m likely going to be using the SavvyMX folks for the pre-buy and ongoing maintenance of whatever aircraft I end up with but I LOVE those articles as they give me a ton of awareness of the inside baseball that I wasn’t aware of before this.

So my mission recently was just to have fun – I have an Aventura II amphibious that I’m selling because I need parts for my RV-10 that I’m building, haha. Until recently it was just my two daughters and I and they never minded just going out one at a time. A couple of years back I met the best human being who has ever existed and she has two daughters also so we’re now a family of six! The four girls are aged 7, 8, 13, and 16. The calculus here is that maybe by the time the RV10 becomes ready to go, the 16 and 13 year olds are away at school perhaps and we can get away with our four place.  Best of all, Liz not only encourages my flying but loves that I do it and is an active participant.  I hit life’s lottery with her.

I’m a HUGE fan of simple. I’d really love a stiff-legged Cherokee 6, but they are so hard to find and often times they are priced even higher than a Lance.

I’m totally open to all feedback but from what I’ve been able to find the best 6 place for my mission (high payload, don’t care about speed, lot’s of volume) the Lance is my pick. Better yet, I really don’t mind the extra bit of work it’ll take to get comfortable with a T-Tail especially considering how much more the straight tails are going for – that can buy a lot of training!

I’m not interested in Turbo both for the reduced TBO and the fact that I live in FL so most of my flights will be without the concern of crossing mountain passes.

I hope that gives a pretty solid picture of where I am – thank you again for reaching out!

[STEVE]

STEVE on May 4, 2023 at 1:06 am #21946

Hi Tim;
My name is Steve; I’m the person on staff that works to answer technical questions.

I did look over the TAP ad in the link you sent. It’s pretty impressive as far as modern equipment. It seems to me to check every box in the modern avionics and airframe pre purchase checklists.

I can’t comment on what it’s worth except to say that something is worth what someone will pay for it. In my experience over the last two decades of working with pilots buying airplanes is to buy the best airplane you can afford. Let the guy/gal that dumped a load of money into the upgrades/improvements take the loss because the value of an upgrade or modification is never recaptured when the airplane is sold.

I suggest you click in the “magazine” tab at the top of our forum page; a drop down menu will list articles and back issues of the magazine you are free to access.

Here’s a link to one of the pre purchase articles:
https://www.www.piperflyer.com/maintenance-technical/1279-pre-purchase-inspection-all-it-should-be.html?jaredirect 

In order to make sure you’re getting what’s advertised you should establish and escrow acct and do all the financial maneuvering through it. If you’re serious tell the owner you want to pay for a in depth pre purchase survey. He may require some earnest money; make sure it’s included as part of the purchase funds should you decide to buy.

I also recommend, due to the avionics suite that’s installed to hire an avionics expert to check out the avionics to determine if everything is working correctly.

The first step in an airplane purchase is to define your mission–the flight length, load, people, etc.  you will take most often. Do you really need retractable landing gear, etc. I realized after buying my 3rd airplane that I needed an airplane that is comfortable, economical in the speed/cost ratio, and well supported.

I had owned a Piper PA 12 taildragger and a Cessna 182. One was slow and had limited load carrying ability; the other had more load carrying than I needed coupled with a relatively thirsty engine in the speed/cost ratio. The airplane that I’ve had the last 17 years is a Piper Comanche. It has a 180 hp engine, retractable LG and a CS prop. I consider it a two place airplane for any longish trip. It has worked out fine for me.

What is your typical mission??

Please get back to me with your answer

Steve